[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4668: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3815)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4670: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3815)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4671: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3815)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4672: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3815)
Streetracing.co.za • View topic - Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
View unanswered posts View active topics






Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 
forumtools   forumtools
Author Message
 Post subject: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 4:20 pm 
Offline
rookie

Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:07 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Western Cape
Hi guys

How do you determine which size sidedraughts / throttle bodies (ITB's) to run on an engine?

I suppose aimed hp/kW, cylinder head flow rate, application, etc are determining factors?


Secondly, because you potentially have more settings with ITB's, should you run smaller/bigger sized ITB's compared to sidedraughts? Depending on the application.

Regards


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:03 pm 
Offline
1 bar boost

Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2012 3:39 pm
Posts: 1073
This can get very complicated and very technical.

Also very much depends on your application and how/where will be used.

_________________
sales@c-teq.co.za


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:20 pm 
Offline
rookie

Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:07 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Western Cape
OK, let's try and narrow it down.

If you are also thinking about side-draughts, it's usually used with old skool engines...

Say high performance streetcar, can be used in traffic at a push, but mostly used on weekend for track days/gymkhana, etc.

Will run on 95, head probably flowed, high compression, cam'ed to make power higher in the rev range, but not loose to much low end torque.

Something popular like, a Nissan L18, Ford 2L Pinto, Toyota 22R, VW 2L 8V.

Which sidedraught would you use, versus which throttle bodies?


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:51 pm 
Offline
1 bar boost

Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2012 3:39 pm
Posts: 1073
I think first decide on a motor, as the motor will play a big role.

Also you need to determine what comp max you can run on 95 with that motor.

My race motor is 13:1 comp with throttles, but it wont run 95 (wont be able to) with close to 300deg spec cam, 8500rpm limit. (sr20) My throttles are made up to work with that combo.

_________________
sales@c-teq.co.za


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 11:41 pm 
Offline
2 Bar BOOST!
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 21, 2008 3:10 pm
Posts: 15112
Location: Goorrood
43 ITB's are 43mm right through, 43 Siddes are choked down to probably 38mm or so depending on the engine and setup.

You can run much larger ITB's than siddes because the fuel injection is controlled by a computer and the fuel is injected at high pressure and properly atomised. It's not reliant on the vacuum an engine can can pull, which is why siddes or any carb has chokes, to create a pressure differential between the outside and the inside of the carb ie. vacuum which in turn pulls in the fuel.

If your siddes are to large for the engine it'll either not run, run really kak or run only at very high rpm. With ITB's as can be seen with the 1.6 4AGE's running 45mm this is not a problem. We've fitted 43 ITB's to a 1400 Nissan engine and it ran perfect, it was a bit nervous with very small throttle movements making large changes, but it ran well in traffic and on the road, you just had to get used to not giving as much throttle as you used to.

_________________
My garage is so leeg soos 'n hoer se hart...


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:19 pm 
Offline
rookie

Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:07 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Western Cape
Valuable input here, thanks guys.
OK, I was hoping this could be some sort of general guide, for future reference, but will narrow down some more.

Engine choice: 2.0L 4-cylinder Datsun L20B @ 11.0:1 compression, 7500rpm redline

With this engine, Datsun competition cars used to run Weber 48's / Solex 50's and make 145kW@7200rpm, would 20V 45mm ITB's yield the same or better results, plus be more tractable, or do you need to run 50mm M3 ITB's?


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:10 pm 
Offline
2 Bar BOOST!
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 21, 2008 3:10 pm
Posts: 15112
Location: Goorrood
45 ITB's would flow more and be more tractable.

_________________
My garage is so leeg soos 'n hoer se hart...


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:42 am 
Offline
rookie

Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:07 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Western Cape
Thanks Boksie

Would it flow much more? Enough that one might have to opt for 43mm throttles?

And what size injectors would you recommend?


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:28 am 
Offline
2 Bar BOOST!
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 21, 2008 3:10 pm
Posts: 15112
Location: Goorrood
Use the 45mm, they will be ok. I'd go for something in thee 350-450 range on injectors if you're just going to run unleaded. Avgas and racing fuel needs smaller injectors, but then you are good for both.

_________________
My garage is so leeg soos 'n hoer se hart...


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:14 pm 
Offline
1 bar boost

Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2012 3:39 pm
Posts: 1073
With that compression 45mm will be ideal.

Remember race motors run much higher compression, but can only run race fuel and be used on track.

What cam will you be running, plays major factor with the L20 motors.

My dad use to race those motors in his race cars back in the day, you would be amazed at the amount of work that went into these. Many small trade secrets...

They use to ports 4-5 heads at a time, check all of them on the dyno, one with the best gains they would cut up and make measurement for future porting...

_________________
sales@c-teq.co.za


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 6:33 pm 
Offline
rookie

Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:07 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Western Cape
The car needs to be very reliable, will be used for track days, gymkhana and club rallies, and I'd like it to run on 95, thus don't want to up the compression any more. Heads will be ported.
Got any suggestions on a cam, Mario?
Would cam choices also differ between sidies and ITB's?


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2015 9:34 am 
Offline
rookie
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2014 10:06 am
Posts: 90
Location: KZN
I was am also looking at using ITBs on my BMW m10 4 banger .Got quite a bit of useful info from here
http://www.racehead.com.au/?page_id=52
http://www.racehead.com.au/?page_id=211

_________________
!!Speed isn’t everything!!


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Sidedraughts & Throttle bodies
PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2015 9:45 am 
Offline
1 bar boost
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 11:27 am
Posts: 1186
Location: Centurion

_________________
Setting the standards

Project - SR5 (in progress)
2011 Mazda 5
2005 1.6 Hyundai Getz
Ex 2008 Mazda 3
Ex 1984 Toyota Corolla
Ex 2000 3.2 V6 Isuzu Frontier


Top
 Profile  
 
 
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 



Who is online

 

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

 

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

 
Jump to:  
cron
yukari
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

Theme created by Talihim Yok for Streetracing.co.za